Inside
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Ryan Hoover
Inside 3.0 — Real-time mobile news app, entirely redesigned
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Ryan Hoover
I had the pleasure of getting a sneak peek at the new Inside app a few days ago when @Jason visited our office to record a podcast (listen on Soundcloud here and catch more PHR here). The redesign looks much better and now includes following of curators, journalists, and topics. There are so many places to find news (both long and short form) and somewhat ironically, @mg just launched CircaNews.com 20 minutes ago, a company you invested in which shares a lot of similarities, imho. Why will Inside succeed where others haven't?
jason
@Jason @mg @rrhoover First, thanks for featuring both Inside 3.0 and Circa Web (2.0 & really awesome!). 1. No one has won smartphone news here in the US. It's wide open. The unicorn for mobile news is not yet here. That's why I'm in the game! 2. Flipboard has won mobile news on tablets, but tablets are a bust on a traffic basis (they are 1-3% of most Apps usage). Complete bust, completely unexpected but there is a silver lining: large phones -- they are gonna win it all. 3. There are three or four very good products in smartphone news in the USA in my mind: Feedly, Inside, Circa & Nuzzle. Here's why they're all going to win some solid % of marketshare: a/Nuzzle is the feature that Twitter forgot to build (what my friends like), but I think it can move from a very slick feature to a fuller product when they collect data from many places (say Reddit, PH, Feedly, etc) and normalize that friend graph data. Boom! That would give you a really fascinating look at the "linkconomy." b/ Circa is a more efficient--perhaps even *better* for some--version of the New York Times. That's why I invested--MG is just a great product mind and the editorial team there is really tight as well. Their news "objects" are similar to Inside's, but we are two sentences and they are full stories. Truth is they are journalists and we are curators--it's two different layers in the stack of news. People curate Circa stories on Inside.com all the time and Circa will probably never cite us as a news source (because we are not a news organization, but a curation platform). It's fairly clear NYT Now is a reaction to Circa -- and I think that says a LOT. c/Feedly is great for the 1%ers of news. It's old school, it's very well executed, and I think Google should buy them and rename them Google Reader -- but this time not shut them down. :-)
Ross@GoLocalApps
@Jason @mg @rrhoover @jason As mentioned below, you may have to add yahoo news to this list. Granted I haven't used yahoo in years, but millions still do, and not only did they make a decently looking news app, but they also added it into their email app.
Ouriel Ohayon
@Jason @mg @rrhoover @jason Jason do you think a "unicorn" can be built on Mobile news? any company out there ever been a unicorn by doing agregation vs content production?
Max Ogles
I definitely agree re: Yahoo News Digest. It's stuck with me much longer than Circa, for example, though I'm excited to try this new version of Inside.
jason
@Jason @mg @rrhoover @ourielohayon Reddit is worth $500m without a mobile app. tumblr was some % curation (plus blogging) and they sold for $1b i think mobile news could produce a $10b company in fact.
Ryan Hoover
@Jason I'm particularly fascinated by the impact new interfaces can have on existing industries. For example, mobile created a HUGE opportunity for new entrants and liability for established companies that couldn't adapt (e.g. Microsoft). I shared more of my thoughts on this nearly two years ago. What impact will the Apple Watch (or similar wrist wearables) will have a significant impact on the news space?
jason
@Jason @rrhoover i've been thinking about the watch and testing all of them. I really don't know yet, but i do think our "lead sentence" -- which is 12-15 words -- will work perfectly as an update/alert. i designed it for wearables :-)
Ross@GoLocalApps
Circa and Inside both on the same day. News curation is the new portal? And I do agree with you that no one has gotten mobile news right just yet. I got Cirac a while back and stopped using it daily just due to the lack of depth of articles, not the content of what they did cover. I tend to want to surf the top of the news for headlines, looking for what interests me enough for a deeper read. I tend to use Flipboard for that, but there is still a lot of duplicate articles there, even after their latest update. So is everything going into Inside hand selected so there isn't duplicate coverage? How are you going to handle opinion bias (especially on political articles)? Have you looked at the new Yahoo news app? I saw it for the first time at their dev conference last week, and they did a good job. And how they added it into their email app for the boredom factor (probably almost the best insight there about user engagement with different apps.)
Nick Persico
The new update is awesome. The Inside app is now in my phone's "News" folder. I've been using Yahoo's News Digest daily, but I see myself switching that use to Inside because I can control the subject matter in the feed. I'm particularly excited about getting curated NASA + Space news in a digest format. Good job @Jason & team!
jason
@Jason @nickpersico Yahoo News Digest is for folks who don't care about news.... but feel guilty and want to know the top 10. that's the bottom 1/3rd of news users. we don't really want them anyway
Clark Valberg
Totally addicted to Inside and the LAUNCH Ticker emails (https://www.launchticker.com/) which have largely replaced all my tech news browsing. Killer job @Jason and team!
Geoffrey Clapp
@jason There are hints of Mahalo in here - using people+great tech to find what they need & want. How did your learnings from Mahalo flow into Inside, and do you consider it sharing a common DNA? Any key things you learned from Mahalo and human curation that lead to big wins in Inside?
jason
@geoffclapp when Mahalo started we didn't have a user base with smartphones.... but we knew that a human layer of content on search would help. it has... google is doing it all the time now. but search is hard to break into... which is why no one has. Google has it locked up, from browsers to mobile. news is wide open..... and mobile, social and email/dark web allow you to really grow a product outside of SEO today. curation is the big theme: some humans are really good at -- and motivated too -- curate content. this release make us a platform. so you could go and add your stories to inside.com/heath inside.com/healthcare and build your brand in that vertical by sharing links that you find. over time we think we will build the next generation of "youtube stars" on inside.com who is the best curator of inside.com/drones? of inside.com/space? wide open...
Anuj Adhiya
@jason Gonna be curating the crap out of /travel - watch out!
Kevin Kliman
@jason I read the launch ticker every day. For me it's the tech focused version of circa blended w product hunt. Simple, concise, lots of value for the time I spend in it... Is inside suppose to be the manifestation of it but for any topic?
jason
@kkliman exactly
Eric Willis
Interested to see how this update impacts engagement @jason.
jason
@erictwillis Well, as someone who has curated 800+ awesome stories on the platform, I think you know the power of a) being able to submit FROM YOUR PHONE and b) being able to get credit ON THE UPDATE itself. My prediction is you are going to be one of the first 10 -- and most important -- curators in the emerging career of 'curation.'
Eric Willis
@jason. I do have another question. How are you guys thinking about building "community". Is that something that's a priority? I'm wondering how you guys plan to drive more engagement. I curate a lot of content (not just on Product Hunt and Inside) and I think the lack of community around the product could be an issue.
jason
@erictwillis we just added curation five weeks ago and it wasn't in the app. so, you really couldn't have a huge community in the product (just in comments). we are going to add a killer community feature shortly: the ability to follow a curator. :-)
Eric Willis
@jason I understand it's still a very young product. Just wanted to know where you guys were heading with that. Cool
Brady Swenson
@Jason I'm tempted to buy an iPhone for this release. I want to get started curating #transhumanism and #futureofwork! And I'll be using the API too. So, really, when is android inside 3.0 planned? And can you tell us about a breakthrough design moment while building 3.0?
jason
@Jason @bswen you can curate on the web now: inside.com/work !!! android in a week or two
Brady Swenson
@Jason excellent
Adam O'Kane
@jason, what role did you play in designing this product? How hands-on are you in product design? Also - what sort of feedback do you (or whoever leads Inside's product) consider when making product decisions?
jason
@adamokane This product is really my vision for what mobile news should be, executed and influenced by a passionate team and user base. The best products come from founders with an "itch to scratch," but this strategy has a limitation: there might not be a lot of people who want what I want! That being said, our API will open soon and I think that could be a break out moment for us like it was for Twitter. You will be able to hit Inside.com and say "give me every author that has written a story that mentions Elon Musk, Tesla, SpaceX, SolarCity or the Hyperloop" then print the "Lead Sentence" from their three most popular stories in the sidebar to "elonmusknews.com." There are 10,000 versions of Inside.com waiting to be built... it is unlikely I came up with the best version for you -- I came up with the best version for me and news junkies ( I hope!). Here are some the key pieces in my mind: 1. The Curator class of users. We're not just authors, sources and readers, we're a platform for curators to share the best authors & sources with others. Platforms like Pinterest for shopping, Reddit for anything, PH for products, etc. tend to scale better because everyone can "lead." 2. The follow topics model. People are really following a lot of topics. When they do, they stick around. We just copied Twitter since they figured it out, but we added email like Google News alerts (which is a great product... if we were living in 2007). 3. Updates: The anatomy of the atomic unit at Inside.com is the update. It's 240 characters, has a small piece of media, topics, an author, a source and a curator. These updates are written by our team of 50 writers who we pay. Their work goes on 365 days a year, 24 hours a day and make every update easy to read and dense with facts. This really is a major innovation in the product: we spend six figures a year making these clean atomic units. 4. Time to Truth: our goal is to get people to as many facts from quality writers as quickly as possible. If you go to inside.com/drones or inside.com/marijuana our hope is you get a TON OF INFORMATION quickly.
Adam O'Kane
@jason Got it. So, so you obviously had a team that built 3.0, but did you give them wireframes to work with? A list of points you wanted to hit? Just curious about how hands-on you were in that process, because I find Inside to be an interesting business with a unique back story.
Ryan Hoover
@jason - open API = SMART. Excited to see what people build off of it. Maybe someone in the PH community will mash together our API's into something new. *hint hint* 😃
jason
sd@adamokane Oh... I have a product manager and designer who are amazing at wireframes and designs. I have a general idea of what matters in curation of news and they build ideas... then I look at them and ask questions, give feedback and ask for iterations. I do this all inside of InVision [ use this link, they heard my love for their product and gave my listeners a free deal http://www.invisionapp.com/twist ] inside InVision we have discussions, debates, etc. Now that my version of the Inside.com is done (3.0), I think we'll see some members of my team make THEIR VERSION of the world: expect there to be a "light" version, a "tinder version" and a "flipboard" version of Inside.com's data in the coming months from the public and my team... thanks to the API Our team is 75% remote, serious news lovers... so, I hired everyone because they love news which means we whip through discussions of the product.
Joe Anderson
@adamokane @jason how do we become beta testers of the api ;-)
Ben Parr
Congrats again, @Jason!
jason
@Jason @benparr thanks pal
jason
Thanks everyone... I'm awake, I've got a big cup of joe and I'm ready for any questions you might have!
Eric Willis
@jason Anything planned for Android? ...and is that Chrome extension still in the works?
Steve McGarry
@jason When it comes to balancing content creators and readers, what are your plans for @inside?
jason
@inside @thestevemcgarry we are going to give our readers controls... if you don't like my curation you will be able to block / mute me. If everyone hates my curation we might step in and turn you down a bit. In all cases, we review EVERY SINGLE LINK added and spend 10 minutes writing a summary. So, it's like Reddit if 50 people checked every link: smaller, but cleaner.
jason
that's a mistake or error.... please delete the app and redownload and let me know if that helps! cc @adamdill
Bill Barol
@adamdill @jason Deleted and reinstalled. Still the old "Inside 101" in v 3.0..1 (15.02.24.18.30.43).
Adam Dill
@billbarol we just didn't make it that far in time, it won't require an update to the app though, that is actually a webpage at: http://blog.inside.com/inside-101/ we just gotta log into squarespace and update it!
Patrick Edgett
@jason curious about the long term business model as the platform scales. Do you mind sharing a bit of the vision? I assume its a bit more than ads...
Aaron Patzer
@Jason Launch Ticker is easily the best source of curated tech news there is. With Inside 3.0, over time can I expect this same level of curation in other categories?
Anuj Adhiya
@jason Can you talk more about this partnering? Is "people" established organization or Inside curators or something else?
jason
That will be the challenge, but we have a paid team of 50 remote workers looking at everything submitted.... we've had less than 5 people abuse the system in the first eight weeks. I think people have this problem when they don't setup 24 hours monitoring (which costs six figures a year, but is the core of our product). secret had this problem, then they hired the montioring company Whisper uses -- and it went away. Also, we are considering partnering on verticals with people.
Bill Barol
Wondering what, if any, controls are in place to prevent (or discourage) an over-zealous curator from essentially hijacking "My Feed" by submitting a ton of links in a given (followed) topic in a short time. This isn't entirely a theoretical question, by the way; it happened to me this morning in the Travel topic, and introduced a mild but real element of friction into my experience of using My Feed. Any plans to allow users to filter on a per-curator basis? Thanks.
jason
@billbarol we are checking every story for quality and duplication. it is possible someone could put in 20 drone stories all at once... but doubtful over time. the travel person is above in this feed in fact! if they put in low quality stuff it is deleted. you can block a topic if it gets to active as well. also, we would 'pause' a spammy person.... and we only allow items that are 1-3 days old and not dupes. so, we are on this one for sure.
Bill Barol
@Jason: The 3.0 product is sufficiently different from previous versions that there's a bit of a learning curve. Unfortunately, the version I DLed this morning still has the in-app tutorial ("Inside 101") for some earlier iteration. For example, it still includes the thumbs up/down functionality, which you guys seem to have abandoned. Any plans to update the "Inside 101" feature? I really want to like Inside, I keep coming back and re-trying it, but it's a busy app and it feels functionally obscure without a brisk, helpful in-app primer to best practices. Thanks.