@rrhoover Done.

@jsneedles @rrhoover evidently twice, there doesn't appear to be dupe checking.

@jsneedles @rrhoover and evidently mine can't be opened or voted upon bc it was posted after the other... also I provided feedback, did you get it? It said it'd go to the maker of the product. @jacquescrocker - how does Ryan get my feedback?

@rrhoover The real question is: What if Product Hunt gets more upvotes on their platform, than Open Hunt?

@jsneedles what do you mean not the biggest cat fans? You heart-eye cat emoji at me all the time

@danielkempe I concur. One improvement for this type of open submission could be adding categories/collections/tagging so that everything's not in one big bucket.

@danielkempe I disagree, PH is littered with Wordpress themes, incremental updates to old stuf and other assorted not-product stuff like movies, shows and so on...one must stretch his imagination to call it all product

@danielkempe completely disagree (with all due respect). There is an insider aspect to PH that is known and documented. Aside from "great" being a subjective term, a product will usually only make the PH top list if submitted by a curator/insider/gatekeeper (whatever term you prefer). Products submitted to upcoming by the general community rarely make it to the top (great or not).

@callmeed @danielkempe Erik, I think that "known and documented" is an odd term to use for Product Hunt's curation process. It's been a while since I checked the FAQ, so I'm not sure if it's in there, but I've heard the process discussed in numerous podcasts and interviews of the team, so it's not like there's a skeleton in the closet. That being said, I hear you on the "insider" aspect. The invitation process could easily lead to cronyism, or to power-pandering invites. However, I have been very impressed by Product Hunt's consistent attempts to give voice to underrepresented groups in the tech world. For example, early on, they reached out to me and gave me five invitations, asking that I please give them out to women who would become great members of the community. (Note: I'm not the best curator, I think only 2/5 are active. 😅 But that gave me a strong appreciation for how hard it is to do this sort of thing.) I'm not saying I'm against greater openness, but I do have faith in the team to adjust over time. And if anyone needs a reminder of what happens when there isn't curation, one needs only to looks at the screaming/crying/weird sexual advances that occurred during the Kevin Jonas AMA. (most of which were extremely cute, but some bordered on creepy)

@kikischirr thanks for the reply. I was referring more to posts than users and invites ... my comment was in the context of @danielkempe's statement that "If you have a great product, it will be on PH"–it's simply not true in a curated environment where only a handful of people can post to the front page. Just like there are great iOS apps that may never get featured by Apple in the App Store, the same applies here. Take a look at these two links if you haven't already: https://medium.com/@benjiwheeler... http://recode.net/2015/06/18/pro... Look, I really like PH and have found valuable products there. I also understand that "you can't please all the people all the time." But good things can go bad if growth isn't handled properly.

@danielrakh you can use the toy @jsneedles just built :-) http://ph.needles.me/

@nivo0o0 @danielrakh that's pretty neat. Thanks for the heads up : )

@danielrakh I agree, the iOS update has greatly reduced my PH usage.

@nivo0o0 These are the hard hitting questions that the PH community is not afraid to ask!

@mubashariqbal 100% agree

@jacquescrocker if you agree, then what's your core motivation or differentiator?

@chrismessina @mubashariqbal Copying and pasting this from their About page (https://www.openhunt.co/differences). > Differences between Open Hunt and Product Hunt - Open and Transparent - Get Feedback on your product - Audit Trail - Community Governance - Karma System (proposed) - Queuing System (proposed) In short, I think the goal is to borrow some elements that have worked on Reddit, make the code open source, and let the community drive the product roadmap directly.

@thestefanstokic that's not what we're expecting at all. I'll still use Product Hunt. Just now there's another option, one that's tailored for the earlier stage / experimental products. Think of it maybe as a site dedicated to only "Upcoming" items (if you are into that sort of thing).

@jacquescrocker If you phrase it like that, it sounds more interesting. Only "Upcoming" products. Best of luck to you even though we don't agree.

@thestefanstokic I don't think it's targeting people who use Product Hunt. More likely the people who are feeling excluded from it. If you look at the HN thread, there are a lot ...

@tarr11 Yes, I realize that it doesn't target PH community - Because they won't want to leave because they like it. There are a select number of frustrated people on HN, so yeah, they are targeting a niche that don't like Product Hunt.

@thestefanstokic @tarr11 if someone built a product for everything the HN peeps got angry about, we'd need about another five PH clones to handle the volume. 😝

@chrismessina they're not public. How they get to the makers, 0 idea. How do they know who the makers are, 0 idea. For something so open, there are a lot of questions remaining.

@jsneedles @chrismessina sorry, just not built yet :) i'll add that as an FAQ. thanks for the feedback!

@bryantpeng agreed! Open Hunt is meant as an alternative -- not a replacement. we hope it'll eventually carve out a place where it's useful to some people

@bryantpeng Except it's EXACTLY like the 'hot' section of Reddit - because it does rank by upvotes in addition to submission time. Product Hunt, by contrast, is less like Reddit due to the restricted posting.

@bryantpeng product hunt's featured list is not like the hot section of Reddit. It is a special list hand selected by human moderators. The hot list on Reddit is just sorted by a scoring algorithm.

@dan_e_gray @patrickjbradley @bryantpeng Sorry for the confusion, I didn't mean the 'hot' section of reddit in terms of having the same mechanism. Talking about post quality, quantity, etc. Obviously we can go into semantics all day ("Reddit's quantity is infinite so this analogy isn't 100% accurate!") but you get the general idea.

@kikischirr It's admittedly starting out as a bit of a copycat. However, remember the original Product Hunt HN post: "Hacker News for Products". So there's a slight bit of precedent there. We currently have some important differences (https://www.openhunt.co/differences) and I see Open Hunt further differentiating itself as it goes on. The vision: a community targeted towards the very early stage product launches. Less curated, more community driven. Post the good stuff with the bad, and let the community work out which ones are the best (and the bad ones can ideally get some important feedback on how to improve).

@oothenigerian I'm not ridiculing anything. I support the idea of taking an idea, forking it, trying to make it better... I get that there's probably some desire for "more transparency" (which is relative, of course). I'm more interested in understanding the core motivations here, and what injustices are trying to be corrected by making the project open source. Just because something is open source doesn't mean it's better, or that its governance will be less prone to cronyism, insiderism, or corruption. It just means that the source code is available for anyone to look at, and depending on the license, to be forked, contributed to, or built anew in another instance.

@chrismessina @oothenigerian I think you are mixing things up here. It's open not because its source code is available but because of the whole system is transparent and open. Here is FAQ you may want to read it: https://www.openhunt.co/faq

@chrismessina thank you! let it thrive!

@nivo0o0 we break :)

@nivo0o0 I wonder - what was there in first draft of @producthunt? I am sure Open Hunt will add features and fix things over time.

@noxowe these seem like solved problems in Reddit or HN. PH does not use karma which seems to be a key component of it's predecessors community. Obviously the discussions in HN and Reddit (and the 1000s of active sub-reddits) are very different from one another and I think OH has a chance to develop their own unique community. It could also end in a terrible ball of fire. I'll be excited to watch. And these are only problems if they have a bunch of active users, so I'm sure that is their first hurdle.

@kkdub I think hiding the feedback was a poor choice as well. But luckily it is open source and we can submit this as an issue! I bet it already has been.